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Thrill of the Hunt men vs. Pleasure of Sex men

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  • Thrill of the Hunt men vs. Pleasure of Sex men

    I had a few questions on this so I'll describe what I'm talking about.

    There are two distinct types of non-AFC men. Thrill of the Hunt men (TotH) and Pleasure of Sex men (PoS).

    Before I describe each, let me clarify a few things.


    * Neither type of guy is any better than the other. They’re not better or worse. They’re just different. As you’re about to see, there are lot of pros and cons to both styles.


    * BOTH types of men are Alpha males. Both types can be skilled at seduction and/or relationships. Both are “cool”.


    * These two types of men have nothing to do with monogamy or poly, nor is this a discussion about mono vs. poly. Both types of men can desire mono and/or poly relationships (though with different results as you’ll soon see). Men of both kinds are very horny, love sex, and (sadly) usually desire to “settle down” and get monogamous someday “down the road”. Neither type of guy should get monogamous, for completely different reasons that I’ll demonstrate in a minute. But again, this is not a discussion about monogamy.


    * As you read through these descriptions, you’re going to think “I’m a little bit of both.” Lots of guys have some PoS and TofH in them, but you are not “both” no matter how much you think you are. One of them is stronger in you than the other. That being said, some guys can be extreme in their style (PoS or TotH) and some guys just be “standard” in their style. But you’re one or the other, not both.


    The Difference Between The Two

    PoS guys desire sex. They don’t care how they get it as long as it’s easy, quick, and not a lot of trouble. For TotH guys, the hunt is just as important as the sex. Sometimes it’s even more important.

    That’s really it…but it’s a big difference.

    TotH guys are always pushing themselves to the limit, trying to accomplish difficult lays. Fucking a gal who was really hard lay is a huge source of pleasure for them. The harder the lay, the more they had to work, the more they had to push themselves for the lay, the better they like it. Whenever you read about a 45 minute bathroom lay at a club, you’re likely reading about a TotH guy. Whenever you read about a guy battling a chick’s reluctant ASD for hours to score that SNL or SDL, you’re very likely reading about a TotH guy.

    PoS guys just want to get laid. They want to get to the sex as easily as possible without a lot of hassle, even if the methods they use are considered “boring” or “AFC”. They just want the sex. They don’t give as shit about the hunt. As a matter of fact, extreme PoS guys won’t bother with pickup at all…they’ll just pay for hookers. Again, they don’t care how they get it. They just want it. Whenever you read about a guy talking about how great Facebook is for getting laid, you're likely looking at a PoS guy.

    TotH guys view the process of seduction as fun and thoroughly enjoyable. PoS guys view the process of seduction as a necessary evil. They both can be very effective. One wants to push himself to accomplish great things, the other wants to get laid fast and easily. Either approach can work.

    Seduction / Pickup

    TotH men tend to have very, very strong game. They know how to get laid easily and rarely have a problem with it. They tend to be very comfortable with people and women pick up on that.

    Seduction and pickup tend to be the stronger point for TotH men and tend to be the weaker point for PoS guys. (Generally speaking, of course.)

    Game Styles

    TotH guys will naturally gravitate towards styles of game that are “harder”, like club game or street game. They distain things like online game or going out on "dates". Style, who back in his prime was a hardcore TotH guy, once wrote that he tried online game, laid five chicks in a row very fast, and stopped doing online game. Why? It was “too easy”. TotH don’t want the hunt to be easy…that ruins the whole point for them. They often look down at guys who fuck chicks on the second or third date for example, because to them that’s “too easy” and “doesn’t require any game”.

    PoS are the exact opposite. They will gravitate towards game styles that are “easier” or more “AFC”, like online game and very low-key daygame. They’ll even do things like speed dating…anything that will make the process easier is cool for them. PoS guys usually dislike the hunt and find it tedious or a waste of time…they just want the sex to come easily.

    ASD

    When TotH guy encounters ASD, he gets very excited at the challenge and will dive right in. He will happily spend hours battling ASD to win his prize. When a PoS guy encounters ASD, he’ll try a few things, but if they don’t work, he bails fast and is off to the next gal. She “pissed me off” or “was a bitch” or was “too much trouble”.

    Relationships

    Whenever a TotH guy gets monogamous, for a while he likes it, but soon he gets very uncomfortable because he’s out of the hunt. So TotH guys tend to be hardcore cheaters, cheating on women a lot. TotH guys need to hunt. TotH relationships almost always tend to end up being either very short-term serial monogamist ones, or relationships where he’s cheating often.

    Because of their love of sex, when PoS guys find a steady source, they have a tendency to cling to that source. Therefore, PoS guys tend to get into relationships must faster than TotH guys and also tend to get needy and oneitisy faster. PoS guys tend to me much more “relationshippy” than TotH guys, many of whom don’t even like talking about relationships in detail and often consider it pussy-talk (even if they have a girlfriend). PoS guys also tend to put up with more “crap” (i.e. drama) from a woman they’re with than TotH guys, who will just use it as an excuse to get right back into the hunt for someone new.

    TotH guys tend to get bored of the same sexual partner very quickly. No matter how hot she is or how much he loves her, he will soon get bored with her sexually and want to get back into the hunt to find someone one new. It’s much harder for PoS guys to get sexually bored with a partner…they can fuck the same chick for years and years and still enjoy it with her. Of course, they’re still men so they still want to fuck other women too, but not because they’re bored with woman number one and not because they desire the hunt. They just want variety (all men do, of all types, it's a guy thing).

    It's a mirror image of seduction: relationships tend to be the stronger point for PoS guys and tend to be the weaker point for TotH guys. (Generally speaking, of course.)

    Disagreements Between The Two Types

    TotH guys tend to view PoS guys as pussies or lazy or AFCish. They view PoS guys as not wanting to push themselves to be better men. Whenever you see a club game guy bash online game, this is the dynamic you’re seeing.

    PoS guys tend to view TotH as immature, teenage-like, and time-wasters. Whenever you see a PUA telling another PUA to "grow up", or say something like “Dude WTF? Why did you stay up until 3am to fuck so-and-so when you could have just fucked so-and-so in probably an hour? That’s dumb!”, this is the dynamic you’re seeing.

    Many times, arguments in the seduction community (and oh my, there are a lot of them) often are not about what they're presented to be about. The disagreements might look like it’s about game style or technique or psychology, when in fact, its simply a disagreement about how the two different types of guys view the world of women.

    As I said, one is not right and the other wrong. Both have very good points. I myself am a PoS guy. Many years ago I had some BIG arguments with some TotH guys, until I realized what was going on. That’s when I stopped arguing with TotH guys, acknowledged that how they viewed the process of seduction was very different than me, and moved on.

    The TotH guy who is constantly pushing others to improve does have a point. The PoS guy who thinks it’s stupid to stay up until 2am to get laid also has a point. They’re both right, just looking at things very differently.

    Where Do You Fit In?

    You need to identify yourself. You’re either a predominantly TotH guy or a PoS guy. Yes, you may have aspects of both, but you’ll have one dominant one. Once you figure out what type of guy you are, you should be congruent with that.

    TotH guys should always stay in the hunt. Always! The minute you get taken out of the hunt (due to monogamy or complacency or despondency) is the minute you start to implode, and often get depressed…if you’re in relationship you’ll soon cheat or dump the woman in your life, possibly prematurely.

    PoS guys should never feel pressured to learn game styles or techniques that seem “cool”. They should do what works for them, not what’s cool. More importantly, PoS guys should never settle for one magical pussy, and as a PoS guy you'll be very tempted to do this. They should always be aware that ALL RELATIONSHIPS ARE TEMPOARY and you should always be honing your skills.

    Hope that helps.
    Last edited by Blackdragon; 05-07-2013, 02:22 AM. Reason: spelling
    How to have 3 hour meet-to-lays and nonmonogamous relationships with any type of woman:
    The Blackdragon Blog

  • #2
    I'm definitely a pleasure of sex guy then.

    Like you, I have no problem doing online game if it makes it easier to get laid with the chicks I'm attracted to. Nor do I care about banging the 'hottest chick ever' that every other guy wants, or impressing other guys with my 'amazing game!!!" Don't care about 'showing off' that I'm a master pickup artist.

    Don't care how many 10's I bang. I just want to bang cute fuckable chicks with less difficulty and on a more consistent basis. Get my rocks off without getting oneitis or too much drama. That's all.

    But, there's a little bit of thrill of the hunt, in the end though, it's all about getting fun and pleasure for me.

    Comment


    • #3
      Good distinction, BD, but a suggestion: instead of yet another awkward acronym, could we just call it "hunters" v. "lovers"?If "lovers" seems too generic, then "sexers" might work as well.

      Comment


      • #4
        I'm a PoS too. (Man, that sounds bad) I've had more than my share of ONS's, but I do realize that I prefer relationships. While I do enjoy the TotH some , it's really mostly just a necessary means to an end, if that makes sence.

        Been married twice, both over 10 years. Lots of LTR's before, inbetween, and after those, usually 3 months to a year long.Throw in a healthy sprinkling of ONS's along the way and that's me.

        Even in the swinging lifestyle, my partner and I have four couples that we like to play with and pretty much stick to them. My partner btw, is my exwife. Divorced 2 years ago but we still swing as a couple and she comes over to spend the nite about 3 times a week. I know most of you will say that's way too much/often but it works for us. We both fuck other people some too.

        All in all, it's not so bad being a PoS. You really get to know each others likes and dislikes and what turns each other on.

        Like BD said though, remember that all relationships come to an end, and that's the end of the relationship not the end of the world.

        Very good analogy BD.

        Q
        PoS

        Comment


        • #5
          For most of my life I was PoS. Being married, I got and get plenty of sex at home.

          But for the last few years I've definitely been ToTH.

          I love meeting other women and getting them attracted to me. If it results in sex, that's
          a definite bonus. But it doesn't bother me too much if it doesn't result in sex. That's
          what makes me ToTH.

          The world is full of beautiful women. Most are eager and receptive to men. Still,
          the hunting is a lot of fun and can be a challenge at times. What makes it challenging
          is that each woman is a very different challenge.

          Comment


          • #6
            BD,

            Just curious if this analogy of yours was at all influenced by the business theory of process-oriented people vs. results-oriented people-- they're pretty similar concepts, just within different contexts.

            Comment


            • #7
              BD, have you been reading my mind or something? This is the exact thing I've been contemplating in the past few days. Excellent post.

              It took me a while to realize it, but I've been aware for some time now that I'm 90% TotH, 10% PoS. Here's empirical proof: whenever I got a girlfriend through a social circle, I saw it as a "free lay" and "didn't earn it" and immediately started losing attraction to the (objectively pretty) girl. I just didn't care about sex all that much; I wanted a crazy story behind it.

              I simply get a HUGE kick out of pulling SNL/SDL, doing daygame and things otherwise considered difficult or impossible. I love the rush and the validation I get from that. I simply love the feeling I get when a total stranger I've known for a couple of hours is sucking my dick. I love the feeling of being the only guy with balls in a club of wallflowers and death row inmates. For me, it's all about the experience and memories I'll get to make.

              Originally posted by Blackdragon View Post
              TotH guys tend to view PoS guys as pussies or lazy or AFCish. They view PoS guys as not wanting to push themselves to be better men. Whenever you see a club game guy bash online game, this is the dynamic you’re seeing.
              Guilty as charged. I actually don't have anything against experienced guys such as yourself doing online game. But I can't stand newbies who can barely hold a conversation with a woman in real life, who solely do online "game" so that they don't have to better themselves and so that they can avoid unpleasant feelings of approach anxiety and rejection. So if someone can pick up women in RL, more power to him in his online conquests. However, if he can't even say hi to a girl in a club and yet resorts to online game, then granted, I'm likely to be harsh to the guy in order to set him straight.

              TotH guys should always stay in the hunt. Always! The minute you get taken out of the hunt (due to monogamy or complacency or despondency) is the minute you start to implode, and often get depressed…
              I'm starting to suspect you have psychic abilities. THIS IS ME. If I'm not hitting on anyone for longer than a week, my self esteem drops, I become depressed and angry and I really need to go out and hit on some chicks real bad. Even when I don't score, a good day/night where I opened a lot of women and exercised my game and masculinity is often good enough for me.

              I can live without sex for months if need be, but for chrissakes, let me approach!

              Comment


              • #8
                Im a TOH guy in the way I like to pickup by doing direct cold approaches during the day, and purposely not drink at night game to prove i can approach and have the confidence that most men dont have on night game. Im also a POH in the way I dont just hunt for 9's and 10's, I also go for 6's and 7's, even a hb5 if she has something about her that turns me on. Also i pay prostitutes every once in awhile.

                Comment


                • #9
                  A few responses:

                  Originally posted by Power-Factor View Post
                  I'm definitely a pleasure of sex guy then.

                  Like you, I have no problem doing online game if it makes it easier to get laid with the chicks I'm attracted to. Nor do I care about banging the 'hottest chick ever' that every other guy wants, or impressing other guys with my 'amazing game!!!" Don't care about 'showing off' that I'm a master pickup artist.
                  TotH guys aren't necessarily show-offs. Most of them aren't. They just love the hunt, for themselves. (But yeah there are definitely some show-off TotH dudes out there, without question.)

                  Originally posted by Bad Boyfriend View Post
                  Good distinction, BD, but a suggestion: instead of yet another awkward acronym, could we just call it "hunters" v. "lovers"?If "lovers" seems too generic, then "sexers" might work as well.
                  I'm open to suggestions. "Lovers" wouldn't work because that word is already used as "Alpha", i.e. "Lovers vs. Providers". Hunters and sexers are fine with me.

                  "I'm a sexer!" does sound better than "I'm a PoS!" LOL!

                  Originally posted by Groundhog View Post
                  For most of my life I was PoS. Being married, I got and get plenty of sex at home.

                  But for the last few years I've definitely been ToTH.
                  I do think it's possible to have certain times in your life where you're one instead of the other...but I also think that if this happens the transition takes a LONG time, like years and years. I've always been a PoS, or a "sexer" my entire life, since day one. And I'm never going to change.

                  Originally posted by Saint View Post
                  BD,

                  Just curious if this analogy of yours was at all influenced by the business theory of process-oriented people vs. results-oriented people-- they're pretty similar concepts, just within different contexts.
                  Very good point and no, it did not occur to me, at least not consciously. Hunters are definitely more process-oriented and sexers more results-oreinted. Years ago I had a long debate with Sleazy over being process-oriented (i.e. "HOW to do it is very important") vs results oriented ("how you do it doesn't matter as long as you get laid reasonably fast").

                  Originally posted by Vexxor View Post
                  BD, have you been reading my mind or something?
                  Yes. Now stop thinking about that purple elephant.

                  It took me a while to realize it, but I've been aware for some time now that I'm 90% TotH, 10% PoS. Here's empirical proof: whenever I got a girlfriend through a social circle, I saw it as a "free lay" and "didn't earn it" and immediately started losing attraction to the (objectively pretty) girl. I just didn't care about sex all that much; I wanted a crazy story behind it.

                  I simply get a HUGE kick out of pulling SNL/SDL, doing daygame and things otherwise considered difficult or impossible. I love the rush and the validation I get from that. I simply love the feeling I get when a total stranger I've known for a couple of hours is sucking my dick. I love the feeling of being the only guy with balls in a club of wallflowers and death row inmates. For me, it's all about the experience and memories I'll get to make.
                  Exactly. You're unquestionably a TotH dude. And that's awesome. In some ways you have stronger game than I do.

                  Guilty as charged. I actually don't have anything against experienced guys such as yourself doing online game. But I can't stand newbies who can barely hold a conversation with a woman in real life, who solely do online "game" so that they don't have to better themselves and so that they can avoid unpleasant feelings of approach anxiety and rejection. So if someone can pick up women in RL, more power to him in his online conquests. However, if he can't even say hi to a girl in a club and yet resorts to online game, then granted, I'm likely to be harsh to the guy in order to set him straight.
                  I understand. However, I'm willing to bet that deep down inside, you'd rather guys like ME did RL game instead of online game? Right? Just a little? LOL

                  I'm starting to suspect you have psychic abilities. THIS IS ME. If I'm not hitting on anyone for longer than a week, my self esteem drops, I become depressed and angry and I really need to go out and hit on some chicks real bad. Even when I don't score, a good day/night where I opened a lot of women and exercised my game and masculinity is often good enough for me.
                  Bingo. I hate to be a broken record about this, but since you know this about yourself, NEVER GET MONOGAMOUS! EVER! Love, commit, have kids, even get married if you have to, but NEVER put yourself in the position where you're out of the hunt!

                  I can live without sex for months if need be, but for chrissakes, let me approach!
                  Haha! Yep! And I'm the exact opposite. I can go months, hell YEARS without ever approaching a gal or going on another first date...but if I go even a few days without sex with a hottie, I'm spitting bullets and crushing rocks.
                  How to have 3 hour meet-to-lays and nonmonogamous relationships with any type of woman:
                  The Blackdragon Blog

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Hunters and Hedonists as names?

                    Anyway, definitely pleasure of sex for me - I try and build poly circles to keep an active and varied flow for myself!

                    But more importantly, this post has actually helped me to understand a good friend of mine much better. He's predominately thrill of the hunt, and having read this post I can see times in my past where he and I have disagreed about things. This makes it a lot easier to understand him!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Someone should post a poll to see what the TotH : PoS ratio is for all the guys here, would be interesting.

                      Personally, definitely a TotH guy. I come from the same place as Vexxor, agree with pretty much everything he said.
                      Really good post BD, helps explain my tendency to cheat and why I get bored so easily. 5 starred.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Very interesting breakdown.
                        I'm definitely a hunter!
                        Helps to understand others.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Interesting observation there and I've never thought about it from that perspective before, nice one.

                          I'm definitely a hedonist/PoS/sexers kind of guy however I tend to get bored with the same woman for a little while so the need for a little variety is there (or perhaps I've unknowingly screened in boring women with little creativity which fits the idea of getting sex with little hassle as possible).

                          Although I don't do drama and detest it (unless it's part of role playing ), so if there's unnecessary drama I tend to dump her then move on.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I think we should also keep in mind the environment one is in.

                            When I'm at home I tend to be more of a PoS guy/sexer.

                            When I'm on the road [even if it's for months at a time] I'm definitely more of a TotH guy/hunter.

                            Nick

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Do you guys think age plays a role? I'm sure most young guys are TotH hungry, while more experienced elders may no longer wish to invest energy into getting laid...

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