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  • hey_lover
    replied
    This is good stuff. A good video that really helped me was from Elliot Hulse.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P41ER1Wmkj0

    I run fitness classes so it gives me ample opportunities to practice. It's always funny opening a girl, and later on she tells me how I scared the shit out of her when I approached. I suppose that wasn't supposed to happen, but it led to dick in pussy, so I guess it worked to an extent.

    No fapping a couple days also helps with a deeper voice.

    Leave a comment:


  • Bacchus
    replied
    Originally posted by Dr Feelgood View Post
    how did you develop your voice? did you hire a coach?

    that voice is great, I speak in a similar way when getting really comfortable with girls.
    I should employ that voice more often
    The secret sauce, is making sure that your voice, emanates from your chest.

    Interestingly enough, speaking from your chest, doesn't just make you appear comfortable and relaxed. . . it actually makes you more relaxed. And it makes people relaxed around you. It's a positive feedback loop. I recommend getting into the habit of doing this. You can place your hand on your chest when speaking, somewhere private like at home.

    If you feel vibrations from your chest then you're doing it correctly. You can remind yourself, to always speak from your chest, during interactions with anyone. Or mentally review previous interactions, to check if you were doing this. Eventually, it'll just become something you just do automatically, without having to think about it at all.

    Leave a comment:


  • Bacchus
    replied
    Originally posted by Logic&Reason View Post
    Gambits are great for training and leveling up phases, any point you want to step outside your comfort zone and expand your limits. Its helpful to have something definitive outside your comfort zone to work on.

    Bacchus did everything right, his "natural" is a very high quality, effective, well calibrated natural now because he stepped outside himself and tried a bunch of new things that were tried and tested seduction techniques. We all see where guys end up when they go from AFC to natural. A few do well, but most end up mediocre at game, rely on playing to specific online apps, or go into PU hate mode. Bacchus took the mastery path. And now he's at where he's at: the top. Respect.
    Thank you for the kind words Logic&Reason.

    Regarding gambits or routines, this is spot on. They basically serve as models that can help seducers, on the path towards mastery. Which requires unconscious competence, on many different levels including, the utilization of various attractive behaviors and persuasive techniques. Both of which are aspects of seductions that gambits can help teach.

    More specifically, gambits and routines help to guide seducers from conscious incompetence, towards conscious competence. Like for example, going from mostly clueless, about setting sexual frames, or emotional stimulation. To learning / memorizing gambits, to pull these things off at a conscious level infield. It's when it comes to things like strategic adaptation, innovation and calibration. That unconscious competence, or a complete internalization of these tools and techniques, becomes the necessary next step.

    And once a guy reaches this phase, regarding a new attractive behavior or persuasive technique. Then it's as you've said. He's leveled up and reached another level of "natural."

    One of my favorite things about PU is the fact, that this can be a never-ending process. Constantly stepping outside of yourself, and moving towards unconscious competence with new techniques, behaviors, etc. In this sense I'm still a work in progress. Constantly leveling up, becoming more and more attractive, calibrated and persuasive with women. . .

    Leave a comment:


  • Bacchus
    replied
    Originally posted by Tank_ View Post
    Good to hear the concrete examples. Deep diving then rewarding with double binds of rich descriptions of her passions seems like a very practical strategy that incorporates these tools.
    Originally posted by Tank_ View Post
    Your voice sounds like mine I've always heard from coaches that this was a liability, in sounding dull/droning and low/flat. I can see though that in this case it would be effective for NLP. Do you sometimes fractionate out of the slow low speech into bursts of enthusiasm, say, in order to emotionally stimulate more to hook, or do you tend to talk like this through hook point and beyond?
    Glad you found the examples useful Tank. Nice question too. To answer it accurately, I'll need to explain a few things about the voice.

    While the voice, is a fundamental aspect of nlp, as well as emotional stimulation. What makes an effective voice, has quite a bit of variance. In other words, there are a number of different kinds of voices, that can be effective for emotionally stimulating women. Not just one specific kind. And there are pros / cons to each.

    On the other hand, there's many more voice types. That will be counter-productive. The difference comes down to 3 distinct aspects. Tonality, enthusiasm and pacing.

    Tonality is just the area, where your voice emanates from. Some guys speak from their nose, which produces a high-pitched nasal tonality. Most guys speak from the back of their throat. I always speak from deep within my chest. This makes you come across as calmer, comfortable and more relaxed, compared to guys who use other two. Done right it exudes power and sex appeal. Enthusiasm relates to enunciation, and the amount of energy, projected or conveyed as you speak.

    Low energy sidesteps neediness, but risks coming across as boring or dull. While high energy is excitable and attention-grabbing. But it does risk coming across as high strung or all over the place. Now high energy isn't too congruent with my current vibe. . . I had a phase where I used it more frequently. Coupled with a more fitting vibe but I ended up getting drained pretty fast. These days I'm generally very still. If I'm moving or walking somewhere, it's done in an unhurried, relaxed and deliberate fashion.

    So while seducing, I almost never go very high energy. However I will use slightly more energy to speak louder, in clubs and enunciate harder at first. This way my opener is heard. How much of this I do depends on her or her group's energy levels before I approach. I'll never exceed their level though.

    Pacing relates to pauses in speech and how fast you talk. Talking fast with no pauses whatsoever, is generally counter productive. Because it's a trait associated with anxiety and insecurity. Guys only do that if they think you're not listening. Which ironically, makes women pay even less attention to what they say. Talking quickly with well placed pauses helps with enthusiasm and is therefore stimulating. However, speaking slowly with well placed pauses is hypnotic. Forces women to pay attention.

    It also builds intrigue. Generally guys who speak slowly, are confident that you're hanging onto, every single word that leaves their mouth.

    It's possible to speak too slowly though. If someone does that and their pauses are too long or all over the place. They might sound confused, or unsure about what they're saying. So to answer your question directly, I wouldn't exactly say I burst into enthusiasm to hook. In clubs I open louder and enunciate harder at first. While still speaking from my chest. Just so I don't have to repeat myself early on. And during the interaction I will vary my pacing and pauses when appropriate.

    Once I'm past the initial investment. I'm usually speaking directly into the ears of the girl I'm seducing. You might have noticed this too. Speaking this way often encourages girls to lean in and close the distance. Especially when using the tools mentioned in the podcast. Because they want to hear more of what you're saying. . .
    Last edited by Bacchus; 03-16-2019, 03:02 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Grodmeister General
    commented on 's reply
    its a myth that gambits are for beginners what happens is after you master the gambits you use starting out ,you still use gambits but they are your own, anyone who doesnt use gambits in the beginning and then when they are better are stunting their skillset and not really optimizing their interactions!

  • Dr Feelgood
    replied
    how did you develop your voice? did you hire a coach?

    that voice is great, I speak in a similar way when getting really comfortable with girls.
    I should employ that voice more often

    Leave a comment:


  • Logic&Reason
    replied
    Originally posted by Skills360 View Post
    Bacchaus good that you move away from gambits to more natural that is mainly why we bumped heads in the past...
    Gambits are great for training and leveling up phases, any point you want to step outside your comfort zone and expand your limits. Its helpful to have something definitive outside your comfort zone to work on.

    Bacchus did everything right, his "natural" is a very high quality, effective, well calibrated natural now because he stepped outside himself and tried a bunch of new things that were tried and tested seduction techniques. We all see where guys end up when they go from AFC to natural. A few do well, but most end up mediocre at game, rely on playing to specific online apps, or go into PU hate mode. Bacchus took the mastery path. And now he's at where he's at: the top. Respect.

    Leave a comment:


  • Skills360
    replied
    Originally posted by Tank_ View Post
    Your voice sounds like mine I've always heard from coaches that this was a liability, in sounding dull/droning and low/flat. I can see though that in this case it would be effective for NLP. Do you sometimes fractionate out of the slow low speech into bursts of enthusiasm, say, in order to emotionally stimulate more to hook, or do you tend to talk like this through hook point and beyond?

    Good to hear the concrete examples. Deep diving then rewarding with double binds of rich descriptions of her passions seems like a very practical strategy that incorporates these tools.
    ^ yeah! this is one of those cases were he is the exception, since in a club i don't really see that working...More at some point in isolation, after hook point and investment in a quiet part of the club.

    Bacchaus good that you move away from gambits to more natural that is mainly why we bumped heads in the past...

    Leave a comment:


  • Tank_
    replied
    Your voice sounds like mine I've always heard from coaches that this was a liability, in sounding dull/droning and low/flat. I can see though that in this case it would be effective for NLP. Do you sometimes fractionate out of the slow low speech into bursts of enthusiasm, say, in order to emotionally stimulate more to hook, or do you tend to talk like this through hook point and beyond?

    Good to hear the concrete examples. Deep diving then rewarding with double binds of rich descriptions of her passions seems like a very practical strategy that incorporates these tools.

    Leave a comment:


  • glow
    commented on 's reply
    haha i know those. A bit brain draining to get it all out Then i appreciate even more that you took the time to share it.

  • Bacchus
    commented on 's reply
    Yeah this is one of those long practiced things that develop a natural feel to them. So it wasn't easy digging out the technical details. Glad you liked it.

  • glow
    commented on 's reply
    Very Interesting - thank you for the details. i know theyre hard earned.


  • Bacchus
    replied
    Originally posted by glow View Post

    could you describe the "hovering to approach" part of what you do? aka after materialising.

    As i recall Gun outlines it as
    * let her see you (hovering on your phone or whatever, looking at the bar selection/environment/let her thinks she sees you first impact)
    * then look at her and hold ec until she looks away
    * then open

    i have my own ways but im curious to how you do it?
    Sorry for the late reply, I've had some trouble with making new posts.

    In the podcast there's something called a two-step-EC opener. It's a pretty simple eye contact move, which helps to draw attention to yourself and more specifically, your line of sight. By slowly and deliberately turning your head towards the chick. Each step has a turn. Mine has 3 steps. First looking between your starting point and her line of sight.

    Then looking in her general direction. By this point some girls will already be looking at you or checking you out. Next the two of us lock eyes. And depending on my read on the chick, I might open then and there. As we're sharing EC. Or I'll hold it until she breaks, then open.

    Something else worth mentioning is this, I like to use my facial expressions, to draw even more attention to my line of sight. So that more often than not, the girl's already looked at me before I've approached. Or to create the opening / pause in her reality that I mentioned earlier. Here's how. I start with an eye brow raise, like I just noticed something in my vicinity. As I start turning my head towards her line of sight. That's the first step. Since I'm generally very still, this slight movement sometimes causes a little stir.

    Then once I'm looking in her general direction, but not directly into her eyes. Like slightly over her head. I'm wearing a facial expression similar to this one (LINK).

    Facial expressions are something I've touched on before, and this one's a bit on the dramatic end. I don't use it on every approach. But when I do, it tends inject elements of intensity / glamour into the pre-approach vibe, and creates a mini-moment with me at the center of it. Say a group of two girls are chatting together, on my left or right side. It briefly derails or in some cases, pauses their conversation briefly. As the two of them look at me. Finally, I lock eyes with the girl I came for, and deliver my opener. . .
    Last edited by Bacchus; 03-05-2019, 04:19 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Grodmeister General
    commented on 's reply
    no approaching women from behind correct , thats such a weak position . Staring off into space is weird .just talk to a wing and or yeah waiting at the bar is also a decent idea . Side is great for one on one ,for groups you gotta somehow be in the middle of the set ..so if there is a three set to your right sitting one two three you gotta open the person in the middle and run the opener to the WHOLE group (different scenario though)

    if shes with her girlfriends interrupt that shit and chat about what you want ,I do this all day long I am jd saw this! Yes do not interrupt a person paying for their drink or if it looks like they are gonna pay or order a drink its gonna get interrupt too early into your set , thats correct.

  • glow
    replied
    Originally posted by Bacchus View Post
    I always prefer to materialize at one of her sides, hover in this position briefly, and then approach from there.
    could you describe the "hovering to approach" part of what you do? aka after materialising.

    As i recall Gun outlines it as
    * let her see you (hovering on your phone or whatever, looking at the bar selection/environment/let her thinks she sees you first impact)
    * then look at her and hold ec until she looks away
    * then open

    i have my own ways but im curious to how you do it?

    Leave a comment:

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