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Lessons from My Journey 2: Knowing your Market

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  • #16
    Most of this comes down to two factors in seduction. Efficiency and effectiveness. . .

    Efficiency refers to the use of your time and resources, and the maximization of returns. While effectiveness comes down to odds of success, and exerting more control over your interactions. However, it's worth mentioning that some screeners, who often talk about the importance of efficiency, overlook an interesting quality of effectiveness.

    RJ prefers to screen which is fine by me. On the other hand, it's a fact that your effectiveness, will also affect your efficiency.

    Take ASD for example, if you can handle it effectively, with prevention strategies like sexual framing. Then you will not have to waste hours dealing with LMR later on. So by effectively handling ASD, you also increase your overall efficiency. This also goes for initial disinterest, as well as women who aren't ovulating and / or currently seeking providers.

    Fast sex with a girls on their periods is a lot more common, as you become more effective in your seductions. Now again, there's nothing wrong with screening, due to life stages, preference or whatever. But an argument stating that gaining better and more effective seduction skills, serves to diminish ones return on investment is far from accurate. Effectiveness will increase your efficiency, and what's more is the maximization of both of these factors, is part of the improvement oriented version of seducer's journey.

    I'm only mentioning this to point out flawed arguments, clear up the conversation, and maybe even elevate the value of this discussion. Again I have no issue with different versions of the journey. Everyone is entitled to walk their own path after all. . .

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    • Logic&Reason

      Logic&Reason

      commented
      Editing a comment
      Yes agreed. Effectiveness can up efficiency. One guy's DTF may be impossible to a lesser skilled guy. The better your skills, the more DTF you can make happen.

  • #17
    Originally posted by Bacchus View Post
    Most of this comes down to two factors in seduction. Efficiency and effectiveness. . .

    Efficiency refers to the use of your time and resources, and the maximization of returns. While effectiveness comes down to odds of success, and exerting more control over your interactions. However, it's worth mentioning that some screeners, who often talk about the importance of efficiency, overlook an interesting quality of effectiveness.

    RJ prefers to screen which is fine by me. On the other hand, it's a fact that your effectiveness, will also affect your efficiency.

    Take ASD for example, if you can handle it effectively, with prevention strategies like sexual framing. Then you will not have to waste hours dealing with LMR later on. So by effectively handling ASD, you also increase your overall efficiency. This also goes for initial disinterest, as well as women who aren't ovulating and / or currently seeking providers.

    Fast sex with a girls on their periods is a lot more common, as you become more effective in your seductions. Now again, there's nothing wrong with screening, due to life stages, preference or whatever. But an argument stating that gaining better and more effective seduction skills, serves to diminish ones return on investment is far from accurate. Effectiveness will increase your efficiency, and what's more is the maximization of both of these factors, is part of the improvement oriented version of seducer's journey.

    I'm only mentioning this to point out flawed arguments, clear up the conversation, and maybe even elevate the value of this discussion. Again I have no issue with different versions of the journey. Everyone is entitled to walk their own path after all. . .


    ^ yes this is a good clarification of the op... this is right on... "girls on the period" is not necessarily girls ovulating, in fact a lot of girls on the periods increases asd and bitchiness... Ovulation happens pre period:

    Ovulation happens about 14 days before your period starts. If your average menstrual cycle is 28 days, you ovulate around day 14, and your most fertile days are days 12, 13 and 14. If your average menstrual cycle is 35 days ovulation

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    • Bacchus

      Bacchus

      commented
      Editing a comment
      Yeah I agree with you Skills.

      I mentioned fast sex with girls on their period as an example of effectively seducing girls who aren't currently ovulating.

  • #18
    Wow, I go away for a few days and this thread has derailed into a completely different direction than I intended.

    Like I said, I suck at explaining things so it was probably my fault for not putting in a more detailed description of a complex advanced topic.

    So let me try again. All of the examples I was referring to was when a "10" girl IS INTERESTED in you. You have already gotten past the initial pick up as in day 2 etc. The 15 hours I'm talking about are not about getting over a bitch shield or ASD..... it is about the total amount of time you would put in over several days/weeks or wahtever.

    As I listed earlier, this is from my personal experience:

    1. Girls who are hung up on a specific guy. They are interested in you/me but have a specific guy they want a relationship with.
    2. Similar to the one above, girls who want a relationship with a specific type of guy. I don't have tattoos, multiple piercings, perfect 6-pack nor am I blond haired/blue eyes etc.
    3. Similar to the 2 above, this is about girls who have just had a hard break up they are recovering from (but get shown a lot of interest from guys)
    4. Girls with serious unpredictable migraines, backaches, or some other sort of physical ailment
    5. Girls at the office who are constantly busy or overworked, stressed, burned-out etc

    In these cases, these girls were chasing me or I was already "dating" them. For example, I had one "10" who I dated several times, but she had some serious back problems that would come on unpredictably. Another used to get wicked migraines. One that I "dated" and had contact with over several weeks/months was very interested and kept calling me but was a bit of an emotional wreck as she was still getting over a break up from a long term relationship.

    My point wasn't about screening out girls ("10s") because of bitch shields or ASD or whatever, this is part of normal pick up.

    The major point that was completely missed was efficiency with "10s" (high caliber women) can be greatly increased by changing the dynamics of the game! For example, girls that were interested in me but were hung up on a specific guy or wanting a specific type of guy, this changed completely once I changed the "market", suddenly there wasn't this "specific guy" or menu of "specific type of guy" to choose from.

    My main point was also that I would rather change the dynamics as this takes less time and is quicker and more efficient rather than learning more skill after a certain level after you've reached the point of diminishing returns.

    Hopefully this was clearer!

    Ok, now I have to take my little girl to her ballet class! I'll be back later!

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    • #19
      Many thanks for your post Razorjack. I always like it when someone can present a different take from the norm and hopefully give me a new insight.

      In the last couple of years I have thought more about location being a factor is success. I have experimented a lot with new places but my mindset has all been about finding the places with lots of girls that I like. I have not consciously thought about my variable market value to them based on supply and demand on a consistent basis although I have noticed girls changing their behaviour based on the quantity of guys interested in them. I guess I never put 2 and 2 together.

      On a slight tangent I think it is also good to hear someone stress the solution to every pick up problem is not always to learn a new technique.


      ​​​​cheers

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