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Mind Prep to Allow Hardcore Intermittent Fasting

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  • #16
    Originally posted by ijjjji View Post
    -So.. I feel Im doing great. Except x-mas week, Ive been eating 1 meal every other day, + consuming 3-6 teaspoons of cocoa powder on noneating days.
    -No real hunger to speak of so far! Will get a bit worse form here iirc.. No other problems either.
    -What surprises me the most, is how well my training has been going. Reason must be its upper body only, doing dips and pullups with gymnastics rings.
    -I use so Im blasting my muscles pretty well even on empty stomach.
    -My meals are roughly 300g ground beef and 300g cheese and 50g butter, with some tomato or even chocolate.
    -Down from 92 to 85 first month. Slows down a lot from here though. Probably 81 a month from now, and 79kg two months from now..
    -Face looked a bit 'saggy' one day, so I tried vitamin C (collagen boost supposedly) and I believe it worked!
    X-Mas week was also an excpetion for me. I'm trying to loose weight again since about 3 moth or os. 2-3 Years ago I went from 150 kg to 89 kg but over the last 1,5 years I went up to 101 kg again. I dont know how much muscle I gained that time because since a half year I'm going to the gym 2 times a week. A lot of people tell me I also gained weight because muscles are heavier then fat, but somehow I feel I only gained weight. However... I'm interested in what you do for living. Because I feel because of the stress it's hard for me to really do diet hardcore because a lot of stress produces the urge to eat something. Or in other words I feel I can work better and more efficient when eaten something.


    • #17
      Have you tried no food day? Its my best solution. All other methods are super hard for me. (If I eat just a little, its like there is a roaring beast inside me.)
      Have you tried cocoa powder mixed with hot water, for killing hunger? (Im about to right now. I did mistake of eating early yesterday, meaning tonight is a bit hell'ish.. aaand I had a bit more carb, which sparks a lot more hunger than a strict low-carb meal, as you probably know all about.)

      FOOD QUIZ: If I store a banana and a whole garlic together in a sealed plastic bag, will they keep fresh for longer?


      • #18
        -Im trying to find the cheese cake that has the most fat and the least sugar. (On lowcarb, that will limit how much you can have for dessert.)
        -I found one where the filling is like 75% fat, 5% protein, 20% sugar.. buuut the crust is made with biscuits and sugar Im considering replacing with butter roasted nuts, but nuts disturb my digestion a little bit.. not aware of any other alternatives atm though.. will test this week :P
        -I may have mentioned that I converted to non-raw cocoa, as it tastes better when mixed with water, compared to the raw version (and 10x cheaper).. also found that a pinch of cinnamon does wonders!! I now enjoy cocoa in small sips, rather than 'forcing it down' quickly
        -Also starting to notice some 'psychological' effects from going without food.. (which may actually have influenced my posting habits too)


        • #19
          Originally posted by ijjjji View Post
          -Also starting to notice some 'psychological' effects from going without food.. (which may actually have influenced my posting habits too)
          no surprise there, however, quite curious: what psychological effects are you noticing?


          • #20
            Originally posted by Kit View Post
            no surprise there, however, quite curious: what psychological effects are you noticing?
            Im normally most creative and best at problem solving in the morning, with attention span and the ability to concentrate and juggle long thought chains to diminish totally by the end of the day.. Now, Im noticing that Im more like an 'explosion of creativity' in the morning. Everything thought related feeling very 'sharp' somehow. And this focus/concentration lasts pretty much until evening. (Or until I eat.) One consequence though, when thinking about something, its like a lot of 'threads' to other subjects start pulling my mind in many directions.. anyways, some things feel much easier now:
            -Dissecting a 'problem'.
            -Remembering things.
            -Organizing and putting things into system.
            -Keep concentrating for hours and hours. No 'mood' or 'boredom' or 'tiredness'.. (until sleepy in evening.)

            Other observations:
            -Sharper senses - especially smell & taste.
            -Feel more refreshed from sleeping.
            -When I do eat, its pretty much lights out.. like on saturday, I got out of bed after a full night. Ate a large meal after 4 hours, fell asleep and slept for 6 hours. I can only conclude that there is a particular sleep requirement associated with digestion, and its removal allows other sleep requirements to be satisfied more fully... but the re-introduction of food causes an acute need for this sleep requirement to be met...

            (I never took speed/amphetamine, but I see some similarities between the stories Ive heard, and what Im experiencing.. speak of the devil.. child I know was put on ritalin recently. Lo and behold she can now sit quietly for many hours, playing with her phone or doing bead work etc.. BUT it seems she hardly eats now, and she stays awake entire nights for no apparent reason, and without seeming sleepy at all the next day..)

            PS: With regard to posting, I feel my posting style has become more 'excessive', both in number of posts and length.. I mean just look at this reply lol!! Its almost a bit worrying, since Im planning to go another 2 months..


            • #21
              Yogi tea did wonders for me when I was fasting:
              -It has zero calories so It doesn't break your fast
              -It is a relaxant tea which means you can drink it late at night
              -Making sure it's hot and to drink it slowly, somehow it quenched my appetite
              -I would drink 2-3 cups if one wasn't enough


              • #22
                Again if you are doing INTERMITTENT FASTING CORRECTLY, 8 hour window, or 4 or 6 hour window, you should NOT be hungry at all... That is the whole point, for example i am in a 500 caloric deficit, so i eat 2000 calories a day, i divide into 2 huge 1000 calories meal, there is no way that eating a 1000 calories in one setting and then another 1000 calories (making sure you get at least 1 point of protein per body weight) in an 8 hour widow, or 6 or 4... That you should be hungry... The main reason i do intermittent fasting is due to it KILLS THE hunger, vs the bro science 6 small meals... I have field tested this with family member, friends, co workers clients, women i am fucking, and they all report the same shit i am saying...You do not need ANYTHING, no cocoa, no caffeine pills, no yogi tea, 0, nada, nothing...

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                • #23
                  IME IF alone is not enough to curb my hunger. I need some sort of stim eg) coffee. It could be tho that I get rebound hunger when I come off stims but I don't think that's it.

                  most people who are paleo and low sugar are also chronic caffeine addicts. It's grueling otherwise.


                  • #24
                    -Chad, I have several Yogi teas, they are very tasty. They help a little bit when hungry. The cocoa has actual calories and minerals, so no wonder it helps more/longer (in my experience).
                    -JG, yea.. even a glass of water helps a little bit. Its probably a mix of psychological effect and actual needs being met (thirst, minerals etc)
                    -Skills, its nice you have an alternative method that negates hunger. No need for the 'holier-than-thou troll speak' though.

                    OMG I made a low-carb cheese cake yesterday..


                    • #25
                      Have you tried no food day? Its my best solution
                      I tried it on monday, but in the evening I went to the refrigerator and shit got downhill. By the way I dont get what you do on day two? Do you eat normally then?
                      I like skills approach with 2 meals off 1000 calories. So in generall I could cut out the breakfast, take a normal lunch and a evening meal and finish.

                      I also feel that counting calories in general is not that hard per se. I did it last week over some days and I saw that I could eat more then I expected and still have a calories deficit.
                      The problem was that I was running into a lot of situation where I had to guess what are the actual calories of what I eat. The lunch at the canteen. The brezel from the bakery. Even the soup and the salad from the canteen wasnt really good to guess.

                      By the way how much water do you guys drink? I always try to avoid pure water.All I drink is a lot of coffee and coke zero. Except when I hit the gym. Then I drink a litre water during that time.


                      • #26
                        Love your awareness here Ij. nice. Sharp.

                        On top of all the other good advice heres a few points i found key for me
                        - Several people ive seen recommends to follow fasting models that are most fit with oour behavioral needs - aka fit it to what works for you. IVe found the 20-24 hour full stop to work best for my "behavioural preferences".
                        - Setting the periods of faste in so that it uses sleep time at the hardest part
                        - make go-to-solution for hard times (me before bed - eg tea, for a self-nurturing thing - diet coke)
                        - keep an eye on the types of hunger - certain hungers are social with me for example, others are early bodily reactions (liver). Know how to adress each
                        - when i keep a more active schedule socially it helps to remove focus from it

                        On another note 20-24 hour fasting changed my way of eating radically. My hunger became more need based and i had an easy time saying no without mental fuzz. there was a clarity that emerged - zen like feeling - and a feel good in the system, a sense of quality to my presence somehow. Doing it w. full focus was just easier for me. tried other ones but it fade out somehow vs full stop which worked well for me.

                        Key for me
                        - Full focus in shorter periods - direct results and effects are very clear to me like this (im Very result oriented)
                        - No cal counting etc and not thinking about it every single day (this drains me more than hunger)
                        - Things to help tough periods and organizing the sleep schedules and activities
                        - viable alternatives like diet coke (helps remove the aaaarrggh moments, and adds a flow to it)

                        - Just saw the focus was HARDCORE. my post was more general and i cant add anything from experience to it. I like the 3 day visualisation, Makes sense for me to help shape my mind and somewhat organize around a simple but effective tool like this.
                        Heard you not the type that you take home to mom

                        Glows Log


                        • #27
                          Mr. glow, it seems we have a very similar experience. Both for focus and distraction needs. Very nice input!
                          -for me, the term 'no-food-day' seems to play an important role. It becomes my 'main objective' in an almost army/trench-like way.. Im like What day is it? Ah.. its no-food-day!
                          -when I did shorter fasting, I resorted to emptying my fridge, so no food withing reach.
                          -with 'no-food-day' I can have a full fridge and even some chocolate on table next to computer, and Im still not touching it..
                          -I never counted calories either, just experimented how infrequent I had to eat in order to lose 1 or .5 kg/week.
                          -I keep a very rough estimate in my head, of carbs consumed though. (Because I get crazy hungry if I eat too many carbs.)

                          -try lowcarbing until keto before doing the first no-food-day.
                          -try empty fridge and only buy what you will eat that day. (Makes it much less of a challenge.)


                          • #28
                            More of a journal'esque entry.. Now that Ive just eaten (a TON) and watched a few episodes, I had a short think, and noticed I think/feel completely differently on a full stomach.. the intense clarity is replaced by some sort of time obsession.. past/future/am I doing enough with my life/where did I put my notes on subject X from 3 months ago/etetc.. And let me tell you, thinking about time, is like sitting in fog..

                            And this 'fed' mental state somewhat lingers the next morning if I ate really big, and clears during the day, and morning after the no-food day starts on that razor sharp intellectual edge I tried to describe earlier.. I kinda get it, that hunger sharpens the mind so you can find food, but its strange to me how deeply it changes how I think and feel.. The Romans got it right I guess, lying down and always combining big meal with sleep..

                            EDIT - following evening (24 hour fasting point)

                            Ok, I just wanted to document the sort of 'swing' going on. It is now the evening of my no food day, and this is actually the very peak of hunger. (You might find it hard to believe, but it is my experience that hunger peaks around 24 hours after my meal, and declines a little during the next 24 hours until I eat again. I tested for 4-5 days some years ago, and hunger never gets as high as on that first no-food day.)

                            This is when the mind seems to start really sharpening, even if its in the evening when Im normally drowsy. Its a sort of crisp feeling, and very unlike the gradual increase of sleepiness starting pretty much right after lunch-time when eating normally. And when I finally do become sleepy, its like a very sudden sleepiness that comes late in the evening.

                            Oh, and its very entertaining to watch food vids when Im like this, because I get this very vivid mental picture of exactly what various foods will taste and smell like.

                            Wanna know what my favorite sweets are?
                            Try googling "Torrone".
                            Butterscotch&Whiskey Fudge is a close 2nd..
                            Last edited by ijjjji; 01-23-2017, 08:57 PM.


                            • #29
                              Okay, final part of my mini-psych-journal.. Today is food day, which means I havent eaten in nearly 48hrs.. So just to illustrate what happens in regard to brain sharpness..
                              -Out of bed this morning and looked in mirror realizing I need to plan some actions for posture and facial fitness. Wrote those quickly while drinking morning coffee.
                              -On way to work, I remembered a vid about bones releasing a particular compound that determines production of first stage in the chain that transforms cholesterol into testosterone, and particularly that he mentioned somewhere that bones need vitamin K2, D and A (which Im not supplementing). Made a quick note on buying liver.
                              -At work, guy next to me is panicking because of a deadline. Rather quickly, I exported a shitload of document titles from his project into excel, split it all into single words and did some sorting to extract the title of all the 400+ entities he needs to register in a database to meet his deadline.. (rather than him going through all the documents manually)
                              -While doing this, I was reading bacchus archive on my 2nd screen AND hashing all his practical advice into the mindmap I posted earlier (#145)...
                              -Then there was a meeting on my own project, and as we were doing status for an upcoming deadline, it became obvious to me that various things had been forgotten in the responsibility areas of some of my coworkers (for which Im not supposed to have much understanding)
                              -I also went over some drawings that I have been using for a few days, and suddenly I noticed several tiny mistakes that I had completely overlooked in previous days.

                              (Ouch sorry for sounding super braggy here, but I feel its needed to fully convey. Now Im about to fry some ground beef and lambs liver, and let me tell you, my brain's creativity/sharpness will fully SHUT DOWN shortly after that huge meal..)


                              • #30
                                Okay so are there any downsides to rapid weight loss? YES!
                                1) saggy face. (any excess fat will start sagging as well!)
                                2) leg cramps. (started yesterday. Pain!)
                                3) injuries (esp, when going back to training hard)
                                4) libido (not issue yet, but the last time it went away completely at some point)
                                5) recovery (always big problem for me. Less so now, as Im doing upper body only atm.)

                                Have to say face looks improved still, even if slight sag. I hate hate hate leg cramps. I need to find some remedy ASAP. No injuries of note so far this time touch wood... libido is possibly slightly lower, but I expect it to take a big hit in the near future. Im prepared so no biggie. Gym recovery is SURPRISINGLY GREAT so far. probably cos no leg work..

                                Last time I ate some weird herbs and didnt tan. Now Im tanning bi-weekly for 20min. Zero supplements right now.