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  • #61
    Yeah thanks..

    I wrote about this and your cornerstone chart here http://www.pua-zone.com/showthread.p...ll=1#post95732
    The Qlue, simple perspectives on life.

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    • #62
      Some interesting stuff here about the process itself.

      Let me attempt to break down my understanding of it.
      1.) General reading/listening/viewing PU theory - done far from infield time.
      2.) Specific analysis - listening and analyzing to audio/video of your approaches, posting about sticking points - also done far from field time

      3) Drills - rehearsing material (banter flash cards), improv exercises - done not right before but closer than 1 and 2

      4) Mental preparation - getting in state (listening to music/comedy) and mentally rehearsing approaches (done immediately prior to field time)

      5). In field - being present mostly. Only think about roles you are trying to play, or preopening things to observe and tease on

      Is this about right?
      (I don't really do 4, I noticed...)

      How much time do you guys devote to each point?

      Comment


      • #63
        That's a lot of left brain stuff and little right brain stuff. I think the point of this thread is that you don't need any of those things.

        - Find 2-3+ things that work for you
        - Make a picture/visualization of those 2-3+ things. Look at the picture to remember them and their associated emotional states.
        - Go out into the field

        Also there is no "getting" in state. You're in the field, you pay attention to how you feel, you already are in state. You can choose to responsd/react in a playful manner, sexual manner, or any other state that's positive, by reacting that way you're entering different states.
        The Qlue, simple perspectives on life.

        Comment


        • #64
          I thought the left and right brain stuff is pretty even there. 1-2 left, 4-5 right, 3 in the middle, actually.

          Maybe you are saying making sure to spend enough time in all 5 is only necessary when you have a lot of improvement to do - (eg in my case there is no such thing as 2-3 things that work)?

          Both ijjjji and you seem to suggest visualizing prior to the field does help..maybe "getting in state" is imprecise terminology as to why

          Comment


          • #65
            Originally posted by Tank_ View Post
            I thought the left and right brain stuff is pretty even there. 1-2 left, 4-5 right, 3 in the middle, actually.

            Maybe you are saying making sure to spend enough time in all 5 is only necessary when you have a lot of improvement to do - (eg in my case there is no such thing as 2-3 things that work)?

            Both ijjjji and you seem to suggest visualizing prior to the field does help..maybe "getting in state" is imprecise terminology as to why
            No I'm saying it's delusional to think you need all those things to be successful. You're trying to assure some guarantee of success by taking all these steps, but they don't do anything, if anything they cause more damage as ijjjji explained with the barrel example. All these things are just mechanisms to soften the blow of fear of rejection. Once you let go of all that and trust in yourself you realize you don't need any of that, and you become a lot more attractive because it's those things that make you doubt yourself in field, which then makes you unattractive, it's a catch22 (paradox).

            The only reason he has those visualizations is because those are things that have worked for him and he's trying to remember those memories/emotional states, or he's trying to share them with us so we can learn.
            The Qlue, simple perspectives on life.

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            • #66
              Wow Qlue, Im impressed that you understood the barrel post 100%.

              Tank_, I think you caught the most important thing from my 'how to' stuff! If you get good at that part (connecting to the moment/real world when it matters), what you do outside of field wont hurt your game imo.. But yea, 'quest for a complete skill set' can pull some guys away from connecting like that when among people. (and also preventing you from developing your particular 'superpower' further..)

              - - -

              A note on visualizing.. If you are unsure if getting this right, I have a very good way to know!

              If a few of your lays came in ways that had certain common circumstances, you will know one PARTICULAR feeling during a sarge, when you are talking to a girl and suddenly notice some of those circumstances starting to STACK UP. Like an encouraging dejavu of some sort.

              If you sit in field with a similar feeling regarding how you envisioned yourself earlier on, then you did an extremely good job with the mental picturing. Oh, and for me personally, memories of past successes make up the major chunk of my 'visual concept' of myself doing well (puppydogging, talking over my shoulder, engaging with girls in quick succession, etc etc).
              Loves: Shy Girl-coding into Starry-eyed Extroversion, spamming Open-loops and Mini-cold-reads and lots of light kino.
              Hates: Putting pressure on others. Things that feel 'brainy'.

              Comment


              • #67
                OK cool. I think I get it. I'll try this idea of visualizations and then adopting the appropriate emotions in real time.


                I still think #1-3 is absolutely necessary for me to improve..but I don't have anything that's all that consistently sexually appealing about my personality/the way I talk to girls...trying to be delusional and imagine I do won't fix it. But one day, I will have several things that are sexy about me, and in that case I see how it's important to focus on those as opposed to moving on to build other aspects of my personality (for instance, I don't think I'll care to learn to be a great storyteller necessarily (maybe just a good one), but I sure as hell will work a hard and focused consistent many hours per week on developing my (flirtatious) wit/humor )

                Comment


                • #68
                  Originally posted by Tank_ View Post
                  OK cool. I think I get it. I'll try this idea of visualizations and then adopting the appropriate emotions in real time.


                  I still think #1-3 is absolutely necessary for me to improve..but I don't have anything that's all that consistently sexually appealing about my personality/the way I talk to girls...trying to be delusional and imagine I do won't fix it. But one day, I will have several things that are sexy about me, and in that case I see how it's important to focus on those as opposed to moving on to build other aspects of my personality (for instance, I don't think I'll care to learn to be a great storyteller necessarily (maybe just a good one), but I sure as hell will work a hard and focused consistent many hours per week on developing my (flirtatious) wit/humor )
                  I don't want to derail this thread into a help Tank session :P so this will be my last response to you, feel free to PM me if you're interested. The problem is that you're still too attached to your identity. It's evident in your writing. "I don't have this..", "I'm not that", and then you project into the future "one day I will".. Let go of the past, let go of who you are and what you have, let go of what you will be. Just focus on your feelings right now, get out there and try things out, form new memories/imprints from new experiences, then you will know what works and what doesn't, remember the feeling, put it on a visualization like ijjjji does, and next time you go out remember that feeling/memory. Done and done.
                  The Qlue, simple perspectives on life.

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Originally posted by Qlue View Post
                    I don't want to derail this thread into a help Tank session :P so this will be my last response to you, feel free to PM me if you're interested. The problem is that you're still too attached to your identity. It's evident in your writing. "I don't have this..", "I'm not that", and then you project into the future "one day I will".. Let go of the past, let go of who you are and what you have, let go of what you will be. Just focus on your feelings right now, get out there and try things out, form new memories/imprints from new experiences, then you will know what works and what doesn't, remember the feeling, put it on a visualization like ijjjji does, and next time you go out remember that feeling/memory. Done and done.
                    Don't mean to turn it into one, either, sorry if I implied as such. I definitely see the point here, when you're in the field (or even a couple hours away from field time), it's important to stay in zones 4 and 5 that I list above (positively chosen emotions and physical states), and to stay the fuck away from 1 and 2 (analysis of your status or skillset).


                    This does not mean 1 and 2 and 3 are not important, or even that they aren't necessary! If you are boring and have little in the way of charisma, you need to do 1-3, but just not in the field. And when doing 1-3 just develop a few strengths really well, not a "well-rounded" skillset (the barrel analogy).

                    So I'm all for your message, and will implement it, I just disagree about 1-3 not being necessary things to do outside of the field.

                    Comment


                    • #70


                      Okok this is NOT a game map. It is a summary of common ways to extend influence over another person.

                      In PU, Id say its nearly ALL about the upper part - connecting.

                      So let me just quickly state what I mean by dispositional. I mean having a strong disposition. As in wearing your heart on your sleeve.. so that people can read your mood clearly. This makes it much easier for people to let themself become affected.

                      Oh and real quick listen; people are often JUST THERE. They are not emotionally engaged, so if anything, they simply feel bored, and/or worried that others may think they are boring company. From this sad state, receiving emotional energy from someone with lots to share, feels simply EXHILARATING (and very hard to refuse). This is how you turn your mingles into something resembling the victory lap after winning the olympic 100m..

                      - - - Edit - - -

                      A few things I wanted to touch briefly on but didnt have time yesterday:

                      Praise. Not all agree that you should pump the girl's ego into the clouds upon first meet. The nay-sayers argue that you only pedestal (verb) her, and that giving your approval does not build any attraction towards you in particular. People who say this fail to realize 2 things.
                      1 - offering abundant approval asap has an ANTI-pedestal effect built into it, simply because it is a habit only POPULAR people tend to have.
                      2 - simply giving a girl good emotions, is like putting a string toy in front of a kitten. It is not this act, but the act that comes NEXT, that will make the kitten chase the toy. A lot of things in PU work like this, so stop being concerned about giving too much away for free. (Several more reasons exist, so please give this a try!)

                      Intermittent Reward. Sometimes, you have to NOT escalate, at times where the girl clearly wants it. This is only way to create what I like to call vacuum, which is the type of attraction that is needed for having sex in particular. Just giving the girl escalation when she signals for it, will satisfy her craving then and there, without adding more/deeper cravings.
                      Last edited by ijjjji; 09-20-2013, 08:04 AM.
                      Loves: Shy Girl-coding into Starry-eyed Extroversion, spamming Open-loops and Mini-cold-reads and lots of light kino.
                      Hates: Putting pressure on others. Things that feel 'brainy'.

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Originally posted by ijjjji View Post
                        Oh and real quick listen; people are often JUST THERE. They are not emotionally engaged, so if anything, they simply feel bored, and/or worried that others may think they are boring company. From this sad state, receiving emotional energy from someone with lots to share, feels simply EXHILARATING (and very hard to refuse). This is how you turn your mingles into something resembling the victory lap after winning the olympic 100m..
                        +100

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                        • #72
                          2 - simply giving a girl good emotions, is like putting a string toy in front of a kitten. It is not this act, but the act that comes NEXT, that will make the kitten chase the toy.
                          So is the act that comes next is leaving her to talk to other women, aka mingling / fractionation? So you give good emotions and then you move onto the next girl, and then you come back to her later which creates the chasing?

                          Just giving the girl escalation when she signals for it, will satisfy her craving then and there, without adding more/deeper cravings.
                          This is my biggest problem. How do I move on from this? What are some actionable steps I can do that will help me "see" and "experience" the right effect?

                          Last night I approached a girl direct at the bar, she was into me, telling me about her cheating boyfriend, and she was getting really close, and touching me. We went outside, she smoked, and then when we got inside she went to the bathroom and we separated. She came up to me when I was with my friends, I introduced her to them. She then went to find her missing cell phone, as time went by she was getting more drunk with her fat friend who was shitting testing me and my friends when we were outside while they were smoking. Anyways, I see her approach guys and dance with them, getting sexual etc but she kept leaving the guys. I approach her later on in the bar area and isolate her from her fat friend to the dance floor to dance, we get sexual on the dance floor, but I try to go for the kclose, this kills EVERYTHING, and she looks at another guy and goes to him.


                          (Through this my mood went down a bit, and started getting irritated and less excited)

                          I approached a bunch of other girls later on, but I was able to hook 2 really well again. One girl ignored me when I tried to talk to her but smiled at me a few times while she was walking around. Eventually I saw her sitting down, so I spoke to her, basic "where ya from, what do you do convo". I got bored with her and just walked away, and she was pretty hot so this may have stunned her that I just walked away. Later on in the dance floor, I see her walking around with the drink in her hand, I ignore her and put my attention on other girls. Then I notice she's dancing right in front of me, and turning around, and giving me some AIs.. but because I was in a somewhat irritated mood and also in a learned helpless state, I didn't bother doing anything.


                          How do I keep women on their toes?

                          I feel like my system is approaching and sticking with them isn't working, I need to do mingling and fractionation like you and Daigoro suggest. Where do I begin?
                          The Qlue, simple perspectives on life.

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Originally posted by ijjjji View Post
                            I used to think certain things are 'cornerstones' (figure).. Im not so sure anymore..

                            Can you explain why these things are no longer the corner stone?

                            For me the cornerstones are

                            Health
                            - Nutrition
                            - Exercise
                            - Mind

                            Looks
                            - Grooming
                            - Fashion

                            Social
                            - Social freedom (Approaching, Escalating)
                            - Friends, Women
                            - Social hobbies
                            The Qlue, simple perspectives on life.

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              Originally posted by Qlue View Post
                              Can you explain why these things are no longer the corner stone?
                              I used to think my 'house' would fall if ONE of those were removed. Thats what I meant by the the term cornerstone. I no longer think you need anything in particular. You do need SOMEthing that is of awesome quality, but it could be a variety of things. The reason why its useful to think of some things as 'basis' or 'foundation' is probably because those have the highest return on invested effort. Your list of key areas is very much this type of thing, no? (Not that it is bad in any way.)

                              - - -

                              On an unrelated note - my updated vision for in-field:


                              Last edited by ijjjji; 12-10-2013, 10:06 AM.
                              Loves: Shy Girl-coding into Starry-eyed Extroversion, spamming Open-loops and Mini-cold-reads and lots of light kino.
                              Hates: Putting pressure on others. Things that feel 'brainy'.

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                Loves: Shy Girl-coding into Starry-eyed Extroversion, spamming Open-loops and Mini-cold-reads and lots of light kino.
                                Hates: Putting pressure on others. Things that feel 'brainy'.

                                Comment

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