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80% Meet Rate, 0% Close Rate. Help Me Out This Hole.

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  • 80% Meet Rate, 0% Close Rate. Help Me Out This Hole.

    Background: Iím a black guy with average looks. I dress well and Iím well toned. Any other useful info that would you guys would need, just ask.
    Before you read of this, my main question is: How do I improve on my same night close rate from my online meets? Else, How do I make a solid day two?

    OKC: I got a simple profile couple of words really. Who I am, what Iíd like. I get a 20% response rate in general (mostly black chicks a few different races falling into the mix on occasion). I could improve that with better pics. Nonetheless, I get an 80% meet rate after I get a response from the original message. The message looks like: blah blah blah, if youíre interested drop in say Hello. As such I weed out most of the attention seekers.

    However, I have a 0% percent closing rate. The meet themselves are Ďgoodí. We meet at a bar near my way. I establish my intensions early, and make sure were both on board. The good thing about that the seduction is mutual (itís on momentí credit: 60). The meets last 45-1:15. This might be too long. But they are fueled by sexual tension: mutual kino, eye fucking and such; we are genuinely enjoy each other. At this point she is into it, her mannerisms, body language is saying the right things, so I suggest going to my crib.

    General response: ďI have work in the morningĒ. Not as dryly but yeah.
    One exception: Where do you live?
    (My location)
    But I have to get back by 8.30 (45mins from now), maybe raincheck?
    I didnít push because I had lost my keys and had no way if getting in apartment. Eh!
    Well I could have had someone buzz us in but.....Also she didnít live far, so I couldíve pushed for that. But didnít. ..I just didn't want it bad enough... I think she picked up on that. She then avoided a suggestion to meet at my place when I texted her a few days later. At which point I deleted her info.

    Things I think are problems:
    Terrible logistics and scheduling.
    Until last night, I was never sure I had a place to fuck her. My apartment was occupied and she lives a ways from meet point.
    The length of the meet: as I said early, the meet last about 45:1hr on avg.
    Validating her: Make outs are vigorous and lead nowhere.


    I have never have gotten the BD Ďultimate IOIí text, Never. As such I figure the girl isnít interested. And I donít text her to set up a day two. Note also I have pitched day two's on when the SNL didn't work:

    Funk:Let's this do again
    Chick:Yeah when are you free
    Funk: [free days]
    Funk: cool let me know.
    Not Solid

    Help me out!
    Funk

  • #2
    80% Meet Rate, 0% Close Rate. Help Me Out This Hole.

    Originally posted by FunkSeed View Post
    The meet themselves are Ďgoodí. We meet at a bar near my way. I establish my intensions early, and make sure were both on board. The good thing about that the seduction is mutual (itís on momentí credit: 60). The meets last 45-1:15. This might be too long. But they are fueled by sexual tension: mutual kino, eye fucking and such; we are genuinely enjoy each other. At this point she is into it, her mannerisms, body language is saying the right things, so I suggest going to my crib.
    I've always found that an hour from meet to lay is very difficult, especially without changing the venue or anything. At this point instead of suggest going to your place, set up a next meet and bounce. Leave her wanting more.

    I have never have gotten the BD Ďultimate IOIí text, Never. As such I figure the girl isnít interested. And I donít text her to set up a day two. Note also I have pitched day two's on when the SNL didn't work:
    You didn't get the ultimate IOI text after you pitched going to your place? Or you never got the ultimate IOI text after a time when logistics wouldn't let you bounce and you had to cut it short?

    It's hard to know what your vibe is when you're on the date, or if you need better help screening before you get to that point. You may need to screen harder before the meet if that is your goal

    Comment


    • #3
      Netflix dates + escalation = lay


      I call any woman that I bring home to "watch a movie", "try some new foreign alcohol" or whatever you're into a netflix date.

      Get your logistics handled first then advance.

      Comment


      • #4
        Have a quick look at my recent online LRs.
        I am also black by the way.

        Your pre-date filter is way too loose. You need to tighten it so hard that only girls who are genuinely interested in you sexually make it through .

        ive been through the sexless dates stage and its not fun.

        contrary to what the community preaches, a girl who has zero intention of ever having your cock on her vagina will come out for a date.

        The weeding-out process doesn't stop at online.

        Peace

        Comment


        • #5
          You'll begin to develop an intuition for girls who want to get laid on the first meet. Either, it's made clear before the meet that they are sexually available OR while you are with them it is quite clear they are DTF.

          The biggest thing I've noticed: they are willing to stick around and wait for you to just put the move on them. There is this underlying compliance they will have and basically "go along" with everything that you suggest with very little resistance. This is all very "vibe" orientated.

          Now, as for your situation...

          You should go into your first meets as something that is only an hour long get together. For me, it's typically just a coffee and sometimes we bounce back to my place just to get them familiar with where I live and for them to see the territory for when they come back. If we do bounce back to my place, it's on a time constraint - typically I have to head back out, or cook dinner, etc.

          At some point during that meet you want to pitch the idea of getting together again. This is pretty critical! For me, I ask them about x movie or x-television show, and then say
          "Let's figure a time next week to watch it together at my place"

          This is typically the sign-off point. Sometimes you'll get the "ultimate" IOI or whatever you want to call it, and sometimes you won't (and still end up laying the girl). Either way, within 48 hours, you should get back in touch with them. Do not text them immediately after. When you get back in touch with them, simply pitch the meet: "What's your schedule like this week? Let's watch that show I was telling you about" and that's it.

          Typically by this point, if they agreed (while they were with you) to see you again, you encounter no resistance and they will set up a time. Then it's just escalation at that point. If she goes radio silent, or acts busy, delete her contact info and that's it!

          And, of course, even with a "fool-proof" method like this which is what I use - you still will run into girls who will bust your balls or waste your time in spite of all this. So, really, factor that aspect in as apart of the things which are 100% out of your control, and NEXT accordingly and obviously continue to put your openers out online and get the numbers in so you have a steady rotation of new girls that you are meeting.

          Comment


          • #6
            Cobi and GD gave you two different answers, but they are both right. Basically, it's all about congruence. Let me explain.

            The standard western world Disney dating frame is 3 dates, get to know a bunch of stupid stuff about each other before fuck ("don't sleep with him until you know his mother's maiden name" and that kind of crap). If you want to get laid faster, you have to circumvent that frame, i.e. bust ASD. If you ask* an average girl to go back to your place after an hour of meeting you, chances are her ASD will kick in. It's just not what "good girls" do. So you have two options:

            - Screen for girls who are DTF. In Cobi's world, you subcommunicate (or even communicate) about having sex on the first date. You're going to have many flakes doing this, it's normal and part of the process. He has many great posts about this method and I suggest you look them up.

            - Make up an "excuse" (movie, weed, etc.) to isolate her to a sex-friendly place. She knows what the deal is, but she can pretend she doesn't. Typically this will work better on a second date, though if you have good skills (sex talk, kino) it can very well happen on the first date.



            * Also remember, typically you shouldn't ask - you should tell.

            PS: 20% response rate and 80% meet rate is phenomenal.

            Comment


            • #7
              This is Blackdragon's line, but my experiences validate it: don't kiss/make out on the first date if the SNL isn't imminent. The vigorous make out you describe will serve to satisfy curiosity on her part and provide an adrenaline rush, while also providing impetus for a delayed ASD reaction (they feel guilty for making out with "strangers", and in your case it sound like they've been invited for isolation/sex without proper plausible deniability).

              Something else that could help is using pre-meet sexual screening for the proper approach (SNL vs. sex on 2nd date). If she's into sex talk and naked pic exchange pre-meet then plan for the SNL if logistics allow, if she's borderline about sex talk plan on a 2-date affair, no kissing on the first date, with movie/cooking night on the 2nd date.

              Comment


              • #8
                The Master has made it so easy for you:

                http://www.pua-zone.com/showthread.p...ate-Techniques

                Comment


                • #9
                  Funk-
                  Could you give us some numbers? Like you've had X number of online dates, with Y girls 18-21 and Z girls 21-25, etc etc.

                  The reason I ask is, if your sample size is pretty small (like you've only been on 5-6 online dates) it may just be that you are having a bad run.

                  Also, I'm curious if you think part of the problem might be that the black girls might be harder for you to close the deal with. Like, they're looking for a nice black man they can take home to momma, not some BBC they can ride all night.

                  If I were you, I'd screen REALLY hard for chicks like Lovergirl- that have a black man fetish and are DTF.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Thanks guys, I appreciate the input.

                    Originally posted by Zettik9 View Post
                    I've always found that an hour from meet to lay is very difficult, especially without changing the venue or anything. At this point instead of suggest going to your place, set up a next meet and bounce. Leave her wanting more.

                    You didn't get the ultimate IOI text after you pitched going to your place? Or you never got the ultimate IOI text after a time when logistics wouldn't let you bounce and you had to cut it short?
                    The latter. I usually suggest a date 2, then bounce. But the day 2 is only suggested and never confirmed.

                    Originally posted by cobi View Post

                    Your pre-date filter is way too loose. You need to tighten it so hard that only girls who are genuinely interested in you sexually make it through .

                    ive been through the sexless dates stage and its not fun.

                    The weeding-out process doesn't stop at online.

                    Peace
                    Yeah I think the biggest take away here is screening. This is the process for me:

                    set up meet over the OKC messages/or after a couple texts.
                    then no contact till meet day @ which point I send a confirmation texts.
                    she confirms and we meet.

                    No screening at all pre-meet, simply because I think I can just 'see how it goes'. I just assume we'll ramp up the sexual tension (and I do)and things will fall into place. What I needed to identify is what I truly want (SNLs or Day2 lays) which one is more applicable to me. And it might be Day2 lays because I can't screen as well as a Cobi would for instance. If I can figure a simple non-lenghty way of screening pre-meet then obviously I gun for SNLs.

                    Originally posted by Dude909 View Post
                    Cobi and GD gave you two different answers, but they are both right. Basically, it's all about congruence. Let me explain.

                    The standard western world Disney dating frame is 3 dates, get to know a bunch of stupid stuff about each other before fuck ("don't sleep with him until you know his mother's maiden name" and that kind of crap). If you want to get laid faster, you have to circumvent that frame, i.e. bust ASD. If you ask* an average girl to go back to your place after an hour of meeting you, chances are her ASD will kick in. It's just not what "good girls" do. So you have two options:

                    - Screen for girls who are DTF.

                    PS: 20% response rate and 80% meet rate is phenomenal.
                    Screening is what I need to get better at immediately because I do decently @ initial responses. Im just not big on texting in general, more so when it comes to women. I've read a few of Cobi's reports and the screening he does I do on the meet itself. Sex talk + kino. which i now see makes it almost inevitably a Day2 lay situation. But I'd love to to be able to screen before a meet.

                    Originally posted by JetSetJim View Post
                    Funk-
                    Could you give us some numbers? Like you've had X number of online dates, with Y girls 18-21 and Z girls 21-25, etc etc.

                    The reason I ask is, if your sample size is pretty small (like you've only been on 5-6 online dates) it may just be that you are having a bad run.

                    Also, I'm curious if you think part of the problem might be that the black girls might be harder for you to close the deal with. Like, they're looking for a nice black man they can take home to momma, not some BBC they can ride all night.

                    If I were you, I'd screen REALLY hard for chicks like Lovergirl- that have a black man fetish and are DTF.
                    It is a small sample I don't have numbers divided into categories like that. I've been on 7 dates in the last two weeks. But by writing this up and you guys giving me responses I realize that the problem is I need to tighten the process up a bit. I am having a bad run but it is not just that. And NO dude, these girls are independent, living in their own apartments and generally Bisexual, college grads. Most em don't want a BF (they say) not interested in falling into un-relinquishing love at least that not the plan. They, like most women want to to get fucked by a hot guy (which they also imply and out right say on occasion) End of Story. I just fucked it up.

                    Things I'll fix and report back:
                    Screening: I'll try to find a way to screen texts. Not sure how to do this since, I just can't have long convo's over texts.
                    If I am forced to play the Day2 game, I'll completely cut off kissing, but build the tension as usual. And arrange Day2 solidly while at the first meet.
                    Logistics are ironed out now.

                    So it come down to:
                    Knowing what works SNls/Day2s
                    For SNLs I have to be better at screening.
                    For Day2 I think I have to the tools, I just overplayed the first meet.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Bad Boyfriend View Post
                      The Master has made it so easy for you:

                      http://www.pua-zone.com/showthread.p...ate-Techniques
                      Hm, interesting. I listened to that and I was surprised when he suggests:
                      a) ask her about past relationships
                      b) actually bust on her exes

                      I always viewed a) as a no-no, unless she somehow brings it up herself, and even then it's not a necessarily great sign, since that's a topic girls like to talk about with other girls, or with guy friends they never sleep with.

                      As for b) I always tried to avoid talking shit behind people's back, but especially in this context it can be interpreted as an attempt to compare favorably to her ex, which I'm sure you'll agree is a bad move.

                      Perhaps I'm missing some nuances, and BlackDragon can elaborate on it in more detail, if he stumbles on this thread.

                      Comment

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